Rules are Hard

 

sos

 

PZ Myers is in the process of learning another life lesson-

New commenting rules

What are they?

The ongoing meltdown in Thunderdome and the departure of Chris tell me we’ve got something that needs to be fixed. I don’t quite know how to fix everything, so let’s crowdsource it — you people leave comments here telling me what rules you think might work to get the knifey-bitey-smashy atmosphere to lighten up a little. Just a little.

In other words- You guys have pretty much taken over my blog and I don’t have the slightest idea how to regain control without it looking like the Jonestown Massacre.

I don’t know about the rest of you but I have mixed feelings when I watch PZ go through this type of thing. On one hand it is amusing to see someone who deserves it realize they have made a mistake and have no way to resolve it. Another part of me feels relieved that PZ may finally stop a behavior that has been damaging to others not to mention his own dignity.   Then another part of me can’t help but wonder- How a man with his education, age, who has raised children can be so completely fuck dumb as to not see this problem coming or maybe take steps to stop it from occurring at all? It’s amazing.

Not only does PZ find himself held hostage by his commenters but he can’t think of a way to get control back so he asks……the people who are causing the problem. Suddenly PZ can’t figure out how to ban people? He can’t figure out what he accepts as proper/improper behavior? Who the fuck owns his blog anyways? An even better question is- Who does he allow to dictate what he considers acceptable behavior on his blog? He can’t figure it out himself? I’m guessing the minute he makes some rules and enforces those rules he is going to see his little horde dissipate because they won’t be able to handle rules. Maybe PZ realizes this also. Another perk of asking the crowd is that anyone who complains later can’t blame PZ, he didn’t make the rules. You readers made the rules so you can just live with ’em!

I suppose this is another instance where we should be relieved that PZ isn’t in a formal leadership position anywhere. I can see him telling a rioting crowd to come up with some ideas on how to better control itself

If PZ Myers wants a couple of suggestions that will get his comment section back in line with sanity I’ve got a couple.

1) No personal attacks/namecalling

2) limit comments to 3-5 per member per blog post. If there is a topic that has proven to encourage a interesting conversation then make an exception.

BONUS

(3) Grow a spine and treat people equally

These first two alone would get things under control in no time IF they were enforced. Despite PZ realizing there might be a problem with his comment section he is still light years away from understanding how or why he has this problem in the first place. Part of the reason for that is- It’s his own fault . He is to blame and he created the problem. Now that he created it and encouraged the behavior he now wants to stop, he can’t figure out on his own how to do it.

The world sure is a challenging place for PZ Myers isn’t it? It sure looks that way, poor fella.

Richard Carrier: Inept Idiot or Ignorant Simpleton?

This train wreck brought to you by...

This train wreck brought to you by…

Richard Carrier has aspired to have one of his letters to Penthouse printed for years. As of late he has become frustrated with the ongoing rejections he has received. Since Dick can’t get Penthouse to print him, his he posted this- Michael Shermer: Rapist or Sleaze?

Here is one portion-

Scenario A: You finally get to meet a big celebrity, for the first time, someone you really love and admire, and you’re at a party having drinks together, sitting at a table. He shows a lot of interest in you, asks you lots of questions, listens intently. Your conversation is so animated, in fact, his focus on you so engaging, that you don’t even notice that he keeps filling your wine glass, and you don’t realize how much you’ve had.
Then you start to feel you must have drunk too much, your vision is blurring and you feel a little dizzy. He shows concern, and offers to take you to your room. You get up and almost fall, you are having difficulty keeping upright. He supports you, and in his arms walks you to the elevator, and your room. You are really out of it and at this point can barely think straight and can’t navigate on your own. You have difficulty walking. At first you aren’t even sure it was your room he took you to.
He gets you to the bed and your head is swimming. You’re struggling not to pass out. You can’t speak coherently. He starts kissing and fondling you, then undressing you, then…everything else. You are too drunk to resist. And you are too surprised to speak. You just think to yourself, in a bit of shock… Oh. Okay. So this is happening. You never asked for it, and he never asked you if you did. It wasn’t even a subject you’d ever discussed or hinted at. And once it’s begun you aren’t sure how to stop it. You aren’t even thinking clearly enough to reason that out. You say something, but your speech is so slurred even you aren’t sure what you said. And before you get any idea of what to do, it’s over, and he leaves.
You lay there in the bed, stunned. The shock of what happened has sobered you up a little. You feel violated. You gather yourself up. You start crying. You finally get your head together and stumble out to report what just happened, visibly shaken as many witnesses can verify.

Why Dick feels like he needs to present this example, I don’t know. Does pretending something actually happened make it more true? Sure this kind of thing has happened but what does Richard Carrier’s imagined version have to do with actual events? An example maybe? An example of how Richard Carrier imagines something he never witnessed happened? The best reason I can come up with is his bitterness over the Penthouse rejection letters. Or maybe he is trying to jump on the same conjecture train PZ Myers had been riding up and down the rails.

 

Before I get too far ahead let’s look at some of Dick’s points, such as-

We should know the difference between anonymous authorship and unnamed sources

I agree, yes we should know the difference. Most people do. The problem here is lots of people do not trust PZ Myers cause he has taken his credibility and used it like a roll of toilet paper. He wipes his ass with it and then expects us to take it from him and say it smells like roses. It doesn’t smell like roses and I seriously doubt it ever will. If Dick Carrier can take toilet paper PZ has used, hold it to his nose, take a whiff of it, and have the same sensation as bringing his wife flowers on Valentines Day that’s nice for him. Most of what PZ says that isn’t directly related to his profession lacks credibility. I’m not saying everything he says is a lie but he has made mistakes when making claims about people’s actions, their character, and words in the past. PZ has never even shown an ability to acknowledge when he is wrong. Anyone who says that PZ has proven to be trustworthy and/or a reliable source in the past is clearly biased, tragically uninformed,  or just plain stupid. I’m sorry but there really is no other explanation.

Dick goes on-

We should also know the difference between criminal and civil standards of judgment; and between investigations and findings reached in a court to enforce public laws, and investigations and findings reached in private companies (for-profit and nonprofit, schools and hospitals, hotels and bars, banks and grocery stores) to enforce their own private conduct policies (e.g., you don’t have to be convicted in court to be banned from a campus for violating a school conduct policy, nor do you have to break any law for that, either).

First of all PZ Myers blog is not a civil court, a company, a school, or any other organization that has any standing. FTB is a bunch of people who know how to hit buttons on a keyboard. I guess Dick is okay with any group of people making any claim they think is credible about anyone as long as they say it is true. There is no need to hear all sides or get any details. There is no need to question or get the opinion of people who have no bias and are not involved in the matter. What  the hell do we even need lawyers for?  Someone says they were victimized, the accuser is known by a biologist with a popular blog, some other people say they have heard the same gossip,  the accused is guilty, case closed.

Does Dick think that the same method used by PZ to accuse Shermer is also used by companies and schools across the country to decide if someone was actually stealing  or if they actually cheated on a test? Well if that is true he should get out of the house more often. Sure an accusation can begin an investigation but it should be reported to responsible people who can check into it’s validity before punishing the accused. No every instance does not have to be decided in a courthouse but most reputable organizations follow a process that is similar to the one used by the court system because it is a good model. For Dick to gloss over that fact gives the impression he omitting important aspects in order to better support his bias.

Richard Carrier (Dick for short) then goes through and shares his fantasies about Michael Shermer’s sexual experiences.(see above) I think it’s safe to say that Dick Carrier has no idea if what he is writing is even remotely close to the truth. Unless he can travel back in time and make himself invisible so he can witness the events he wasn’t there so it all comes down to- A bunch of shit. Dick can write fictional stories. We can put him up there with other fictional writers like say…. L Ron Hubbard. Very impressive but not useful.

 

Dick continues on-

 But the preponderance of evidence (a civil court burden, whereby a claim need only have a better than 50% chance of being true, so even just a 50.1% chance of being true would win a case) is enough for me to conclude that the general picture is probably true: Shermer pursues sex with women a lot, both one-night stands and ongoing affairs, and he has often enough done so without telling his wife or his various girlfriends. His recent attempt to compel PZ Myers to retract his report of what a witness told him appeared to deny even this (that Shermer has lots of consensual trysts and affairs), which I think is disingenuous at this point.

At this point I think it is fair to ask Dick to make up his mind. Is he going to treat this as if PZ’s blog is a court of law (civil or otherwise) or is he going to claim that accepted legal procedures do not apply because it is not a court? You can’t have it both ways Dick. If we are to consider the comparison used above then it is important to note that in a civil case ALL SIDES OF THE ISSUE ARE HEARD BEFORE ANY JUDGEMENT.

How hard is it to understand? Richard Carrier is educated isn’t he? He is supposed to be intelligent. I’m sorry but this application of logic when it fits what you want to believe is exactly like the behavior of religious people. In their day to day life they apply a certain logic to everything they do because if they didn’t it would be almost impossible to function. When they consider religion a entirely different set of rules come into play because religion is different and isn’t subject to the kind of logic that allows you to function and stay alive in the world you actually live in.  Richard Carrier, PZ Myers, and all the other people who are using this emotional and/or flawed formula are doing the same thing.

I don’t know what the fuck has happened to Dick and PZ and all the other morons who want to try and convince us there is a public process which has no connection to the court system and it should be used to pronounce judgement on people accused of improper behavior or crimes. Sure there is a court of public opinion but people should be responsible when voicing their opinion.

Popular public personalities/figures should be aware that their opinion carries weight. When Jenny Mcarthy said

 The idea that vaccines are a primary cause of autism is not as crackpot as some might wish.

I would assume she thought she was telling the truth. She was incorrect though, the idea was based on completely useless or just plain made-up data. The doctor who had said there was a link was a crackpot. Jenny had given him credibility and we all know the damage that has been done due to her irresponsible behavior. She said it in an attempt to protect children much in the way PZ, Dick and others are claiming to be protecting women from rape. But at what cost? No matter how they want to twist and turn and selectively use examples the bottom line is they are accusing a man of breaking a serious law and they have portrayed him as guilty by way of hearsay, without allowing him to answer his accuser. In fact without allowing him to answer at all. Now that the accusation and presumption of guilt have been made he can not answer without legal council. He would be an idiot to do so, especially considering the types of buffoons he is dealing with here. We all want to know the truth but PZ the Clown has made that even more difficult by acting like a twit.

I’d really like anyone who also chooses to ride the PZ Myers conjecture express to imagine if it was them. Imagine if this was the typical process we used to find innocence /guilt. Even the court of public opinion doles out punishment. Punishment should be deserved. Whether it is deserved should depend  on fair unbiased people learning as much factual information about the issue as possible and listening to all sides in order to form and educated opinion about the how events occurred.

redflag

There is a big red flag here. This red flag has popped up time and time again when you read some posts at FTB. There is no link to an opposite point of view. If the writers were honest, thought they had a sound argument, and respected their readers enough to allow them to come to their own conclusions after hearing all sides, then they would give the reader a way to find that information. Whenever you don’t find a link to the original information or the opposing view being criticized, unless it is unavailable, then that is a red flag. This is an important point. There is usually a reason the other side isn’t being represented in some form and that reason is almost never good.

Divide and Conquer?

 


split

   I keep thinking PZ Myers will get it. One morning he will wake up, look in the mirror and have a sudden epiphany. He will finally realize that he doesn’t know everything and it’s been obvious to everyone the entire time. The hypocrisy he has displayed will give him a feeling of embarrassment that washes over him as if he had jumped into a pool of ice water. The character assassinations he has been guilty of will give him the same feeling of regret one would have after waking up naked on a park bench after a night of drinking. The name calling would cause him to imagine his dignity falling out of his body onto the floor wiggling around as if a pair of hands were grasping it and choking it to death until it withered into what resembled a dried up leaf and blew away. All the lies, bullshit, and excuses that seemed so clever at the time now are now revealed to him for what they really were, childish attempts to cover up behavior that should have been unthinkable. Suddenly he sees through the eyes of all the reasonable, rational people of the world and comes to the conclusion it is far past the time to shut the fuck up.

I couldn’t be more mistaken. Instead he offers this-This is not an update

Remember when Dick Carrier called for people to pick which side they wanted to be on? You were either A+ or you were less than A+. Dick stopped just short of calling for fighting in the streets. It took an overwhelming rejection of Dick and his dickish ideas on a youtube video of him at the 2013 American Atheist convention to drive the point home. It wasn’t easy to convince Dick he could be wrong. It is possible he is still convinced it’s all a bad dream and is just playing along until he wakes up and gets a chance to kick some non A+ ass.

Despite the public voting down the A+ rhetoric and ignoring calls to actively divide the atheist/skeptic community the first time around, PZ thinks it’s a good idea to make that call once again. Let me make sure you all understand what my point is- PZ Myers is actively calling for people to choose sides on a issue that has become the biggest dividing force among atheist/skeptic activists. Does anyone think this is a good suggestion? What kind of example are we if we can’t get along?

What rational, sane person would do this? What intelligent, educated adult makes such a childish public demand of people? In case PZ doesn’t know it there were already enough sides before he tried to force his ideology on all of us and condemn anyone who doesn’t agree completely with whatever he tells them to.

Sexual harassment? PZ says it is bad, bad, bad! The predatory habits of old white men must be stopped! They are running rampant and harassing women constantly! Oh, unless they do this…this is okay as long as your name is PZ.

In this case it was just a “joke”. Or the subject was reproduction, how else could PZ possibly make his point except by suggesting his volunteer make her way to his hotel room?

News flash PZ. I don’t think there is a company in the country that would be okay with the behavior demonstrated here and I’m not even going to mention the suggestion you make to the woman introducing you that she “dance” then you tell her to “go away”.  You dismiss her because you “have work to do”. The man has work to do. it doesn’t matter if it is a joke or not PZ it can still be harassment. If someone in the audience finds it offensive, it is harassment.

Before you keep on harping about people picking sides and warning them about people who may or may not be guilty of harassing women. You need to check your own behavior. You never even showed enough awareness to admit you were guilty of making a bad call when propositioning a woman on a stage in front of an entire conference. You think gossip is enough to say whatever you want about someone else cause we aren’t in a court of law. But when you are on video clearly behaving in a fashion just as bad as anyone you have been critical of if not worse it is no big deal. Who the fuck convinced you that you are better than anyone else? What makes your intentions pure but anyone else’s sinister? Because you were doing it in plain sight you couldn’t have had any improper intent?  Criminals have been known to claim that the best way to commit a crime is “in plain sight”  cause no one expects it and a great defense is “why would I commit a crime in plain sight? I’m not stupid”

Or we can follow the example PZ sets when it comes to compassion for rape victims. What kind of cold bastard would make a joke of rape? Well funny you asked, this kind.

I’m not sure what weak excuse PZ came up with for this crap but if I had to guess…I’d say…it was.. “Reap Paden is a ranting asshole”  that’s a logic embraced by “the horde of morons”. The screeching socially dysfunctional commenters  that reside in the Pharyngula basement will constantly dismiss any valid points because they don’t like the person making those points.

If any of those little feeble minded horders is reading this I’d like to inform them that calling people names, telling people to kill themselves, or using “shut the fuck up and go away”  to support your point doesn’t make your point any stronger and it doesn’t make you tough or intimidating. The Pharyngula comment section isn’t quite the model of a tough intelligent place where smart people don’t take any shit that you seem to see it as. What kind of people feel like they need to attack EVERY SINGLE instance of a person saying anything that doesn’t fit into your bubble? What is so hard about leaving people alone to voice their differing opinion and letting the reader make up their own mind?  The way you all give each other “virtual high fives” as you squash any and every contrasting opinion makes me embarrassed for you. The way you think it is an achievement when you verbally abuse another person for simply not sharing your point of view is a very sad commentary on your life. The way you belittle people who point out your petty and juvenile behavior is pitiful. You are like drunks who are trying to make fun of the guy who called you an alcoholic but you have trouble getting the words out due to the shakes. You end up laughing at your own joke but no one else could understand what the fuck you were saying so they just walk away slowly as you continue to try and high five each other and mumble insults. yet you still consider yourself some kind of force or threat. The only thing you are a threat to is yourselves. I can say that there has never been one single instance of my feeling anything close to threatened by any of ya. It’s laughable.

brokenA

 I’m not gonna pick a “side” the suggestion sounds childish, it’s just more from the playground bully. Even though I’ve come to expect as much from PZ I still have an optimistic hope for an epiphany.

 

Who gets the bill ?

6thamedment

I’m  watching the debate over the legal action that could be taken over PZ Myers’ blog post about Michael Shermer being guilty of what can be defined as rape. I have been looking into the  laws regarding libel and defamation. My interpretation of the law makes me think Shermer already has a case not only proving defamation but also damages resulting from it.But….

One comment on my last blog post got me thinking


HJ Hornbeck
Submitted on 2013/08/14 at 1:30 pm

I take it none of you have read the complaint, then? It claims to have strong evidence that Myers knew the allegations are false, but then makes some trivially inaccurate statements such as:

1. Carrie Poppy is a member of FtB.
2. The “Grenade” thread is the most popular thread on Pharyngula.

It reads as boilerplate legal intimidation, with no substance behind it. Why didn’t they reveal their proof that the allegations are false, right then and there? Why are they stringing us out? This complaint looks groundless, to a skeptical eye.

Groundless? I’m not sure if I would describe it like that. I will say if Shermer has no recourse on something like what PZ has posted then we have a bigger issue to consider. This will have/has had a negative effect on Michael Shermer’s reputation. No matter what happens now a level of damage has been done. Its not unreasonable to think it will effect his income also and that should not be allowed to happen. We have a court system and people have a right to defend themselves when accused of a crime. PZ is attempting to circumvent that system. All of us should hope that is not allowed to happen not only for Michael Shermer but for our own sake. Because this type of thing could happen to anyone whether you are smart enough to realize it or not.

PZ Myers should be ashamed. How can he not see what effect his actions have had? There is a clear pattern he has established. When PZ can not win a debate or when he is too lazy to even try he attacks a person’s character. This is no better than the Christian who starts calling you a satanist or sinner when they find out you don’t believe in god or the anti vaxer who calls you a retard because you don’t believe their theory. In fact it is far worse. I don’t care if someone calls me an asshole or even a ranting asshole. To be honest I probably am on occasion at least from the perspective of some people. There are people who think differently than me, I can deal with that. When someone calls me a racist then they are accusing me of judging someone based purely on the way they were born. That’s not an accurate description of my character and anyone who knows me will attest to that. While that is a cheap shot it isn’t really accusing someone of being guilty of a crime in most cases.

Up until recently that was the level PZ Myers had sunk to. He had been doing it to creationists for years and shame on us for laughing at the clown while he performed his circus act on people who may have deserved it in some cases but as it turns out we encouraged bad habits.

Now those bad habits have come back to bite us on the ass. Anyone who thinks this bullshit PZ has pulled on Shermer is okay because “he can handle it” due to his popularity or because he is a white male is living in a fantasy land. Plenty of lives, all kinds of lives, have been ruined by unfounded allegations just like PZ has made about Shermer.

Anyone who is comfortable with PZ making allegations of someone being guilty of rape the way he has needs to consider a few things. Are false accusations ever made against people? Is there anyone who hasn’t been accused of doing something they did not do? How did it make you feel? Did the person who accused you think they had evidence that proved you were guilty? What if you were never allowed to defend yourself or explain the circumstances involved?

If it is not made clear that we support due process and frown on individuals taking such matters into their own hands then we will likely see this happen again in the future. I even did the work for you so feel free to cut and paste. Maybe if we took a couple minutes to email PZ  about our concerns it would be helpful.

Attention PZ Myers- We have a Bill of Rights for a reason. You are not above the law of the land. There are far more responsible ways you could have dealt with the issue involving Mr Shermer and been fair to all parties. You have not been elected to any position that allows you to cast judgement as to whether others are guilty of any crime. Your failure to realize your blunder even in the face of so much outcry against it only proves my point that you are not competent enough to act responsibly or to realize when the circumstances require the assistance of people experienced in such matters. You obviously have no such experience or there would be no need for threat of legal action against you. Your actions are an abuse of the right to free speech and could be compared to shouting “fire!” in a crowded theater. In other words your actions have the potential to harm others. Please read with the documents this country was founded on and familiarize yourself with the basic rights we enjoy in this country. If you could also refrain from abusing those rights in the future it would be helpful on many levels. There has been enough conflict among a small portion of  atheists/skeptics up to this point and if you could attempt to address matters that concern you in responsible ways that will minimize un-needed dramatic effect it would set a good example for others. An effort to refrain from personal attacks on others could also be beneficial to those involved the atheist/skeptical “community”.

Thanks in advance

Signed-

Reasonable People 

Libelous


PZLIBELOUS

 Well seems that wishes do come true. After PZ Myers took it upon himself to say some nasty things about Michael Shermer. Mr Shermer answered PZ, well he didn’t actually answer himself, his lawyers did though. And since PZ has removed the post from his blog I figured I would make sure people get a chance to observe the smack he received upside the head. So here you go. …

shermerslawyerletter
shermer1


shermer2shermer3

shermer4

 

shermer6

 

Gotta like that. Will PZ learn anything from this? Probably not and you can’t teach common sense so we will probably see more stupid and/or irresponsible blabber coming from PZ in the future but in this case he got called on it. I’m glad Michael Shermer took care of business in an adult manner. Pity PZ can’t follow his example.

The Dishonorable PZ Myers

pzjudge

If all judges were like PZ Myers we would all be screwed

Not too long ago I wrote about how PZ Myers had removed the list he used to slander/libel people who had made him feel stupid/wrong/childish called “the dungeon”

I wondered if PZ had learned anything. Had he realized why his dungeon was unfair to people? Was he going to keep the focus of the argument on ideas instead of personal attacks or character assassination? It doesn’t seem he has learned much, in fact he has sunk to a new low.

PZ wrote a post titled What do you do when someone pulls the pin and hands you a grenade?

In that post he talks about accusations against Michael Shermer. Someone had contacted PZ and told a story. PZ takes it upon himself to present this information to the public along with his own feelings (bias). PZ acts as if this is a huge burden on his part and he had to give great thought to whether he was going to post the accusations or not.

Then he puts on his suit of armor, declares himself a noble knight and posts the information.

PZ has no idea if the accusations are true, none. Despite that he paints a picture of a poor victim who has no choice but to turn to PZ Myers and hope he can save anyone else from being a victim of something no one knows really happened.

I’m not saying that the person who contacted PZ is lying. I am saying PZ Myers knows jack shit about the situation. To him it is nothing more than gossip. I guess it is now PZ Myers duty to repeat anything he hears like a parrot never giving any real thought to whether it is true or not?

PZ tries to rationalize his behavior by saying he knows the person who contacted him. Big fucking deal. Just because PZ knows someone it does not make anything they say more or less true than if they were unknown to him. News flash PZ – Even people you know sometimes lie and sometimes the memories people have of an event are not completely accurate.

If I take into account the history PZ has of lying about people and repeating any accusations against others by his friends as factual then his credibility is less than zero. PZ is a known liar, he lied about me so I know this is a fact.

PZ acts like he is a judge and jury. At one point he says-

She’s also afraid that the person who assaulted her before could try to hurt her again.

And he follows with-

Do I stand up for the one who has no recourse, no way out, no other option to help others, or do I shelter the powerful big name guy from an accusation I can’t personally vouch for, except to say that I know the author, and that she’s not trying to acquire notoriety

Does that sound like an unbiased opinion? Who the fuck does PZ Myers think he is? Why does he insist on acting like he is still in high school? Over and over again he behaves in ways that you would expect to see when dealing with a 15 year old kid. His answer to critics is to lie, deny or name call. He dismisses people as assholes or morons and acts as if he is so superior that he need not even consider the opinions of those people, they are just stupid.

pzjury

A jury of PZ Myers peers…

PZ is a classic example of someone who is too stupid to understand how dumb he is. He just floats along in a bubble of conceit casting judgement on people oblivious to the immature irresponsible idiocy he is spreading.

What if someone comes to PZ with accusations of child molestation against someone else? I guess we can count on PZ to repeat anything he hears about anyone as long as he judges the person making the accusation as credible.

I’d love to know if PZ Myers ever considered maybe he is wrong about the credibility of the person who contacted him. What if it is all wrong and the story is nothing like it was presented to him? Then what?

Don’t we have a justice system where people are innocent until proven guilty? There is a reason that system is in place. PZ Myers actions are what you get when you allow just any egotistical moron to cast judgement on others.

If what he has presented is true then it should be presented in public so the truth is known but reaching the truth takes much much more than PZ Myers uninformed opinion.

A responsible adult would have at least contacted Shermer and got the other side of the story. PZ didn’t even try. Yea that’s just great a lazy, biased, ignorant dolt is dealing out justice just what we need. Thanks PZ maybe you should run for a position as judge in MN.

If anything proves that atheism does not make you anything except a person who does not believe in god/gods, PZ does. He has proven that when he claimed he was no longer a skeptic it was the complete truth.

PZ, you have done enough damage to other people as well as yourself, please shut up. Not because I don’t want to hear another point of view but because I want to hear a informed, well thought out, unbiased point of view. You are not that by a long shot.

Of course when surrounded by his “horde” PZ thinks that the number of people who agree with him indicates whether he is wrong/right. Since most of the horde are mental midgets who toss out barbs of contempt and overwhelm any dissent with a flood of asininity there is little of value they provide to any debate. Their sole purpose seems to be to reinforce whatever PZ posts and to defend him even when faced with blatant examples of his hypocrisy.

Again remember I am not addressing whether the accusations PZ presented to the public are true/false. I am calling on PZ Myers to act like a responsible adult. I’m embarrassed for PZ that he has become so convinced of his inability to be be wrong that he is destroying other people’s lives. He could at least refrain from harming others.

PZ talks about how it will harm his reputation because he “outed” a big name skeptic. What is going to hurt him is the manner in  which he did so. Again PZ just isn’t bright enough to understand this fact. It’s no wonder he feels like other are always misunderstanding him he has no idea why a lot of things happen, the world is too complicated for him maybe.

What should now happen is people should inform PZ that what he did was wrong and why (for what good that will do). Hopefully he sees some legal action on behalf of Mr Shermer. David Silverman should go on public record and explain to PZ how wonderful he could be if he would just stop with “the shit”. Considering how David jumped on Justin Vacula for mistakenly posting an address I wonder how he feels about publicly accusing and basically blaming a person for rape without due process?

In case you hadn’t noticed I did try to stay out of the bullshit. I gave PZ credit for removal of the dungeon and then I shut my mouth. What happens when you leave people like PZ alone? SEE ABOVE.

That is why I am not going to just ignore him. PZ has the potential to be very dangerous to others due to his outright stupidity and over inflated ego. He can not just be left alone.

pzwitch

Less For More, More Often

twinkieTwinkies are back. I like twinkies, a lot of the bad things you hear about the snack are bullshit or no worse than any other food product. The one thing I’d like to address is the difference in the old snack and its reincarnation, size. The new twinkies are slightly smaller. It should be noted that the size change isn’t something the current makers of twinkies came up with. The size change was actually made before Hostess went out of business the first time. It was an attempt to save on costs. The attempt was too little too late. That is not always the case and this type of business practice has become all the rage.

Ice cream makers re-defining the measurement of their product quietly. The candy bar makers making that candy bar just a bit thinner or maybe just the chocolate covering. Adding air to a product and pronouncing it “dreamy” or “delightfully light”  all the while the ruse is on. The only thing that has changed is your willingness to pay for empty space.

hersheysair

Paying for stuff filled with “air”? Sucker.

When is the last time you saw a product announce it was cutting its size and it’s price? That would at least be honest. It’s the sneaky factor that worries me. Everybody and their parent company are trying to pull a fast one on us just to make more money.

Tropicana was one company thinking of the customer. When there was a big freeze and it effected orange crops. They tried to think of a way to keep the freeze from having an impact on their customers. The solution they came up with was to drop the size of the container by 5oz from 64oz to 59oz.  That way the price per ounce went up but nobody was effected because what you don’t know can’t hurt you , right?

You're gonna pay extra and like it. Get it?

You’re gonna pay extra and like it. Get it?

Pre-mixed anti-freeze, but there is no mention the mix consists of anti-freeze and ….water. The price? Sometimes even more that you would pay for anti-freeze without that hard to get extra water they add.

When you sell a million of something all you have to do is cut a little to make a lot. Sometimes companies are bulking up the packaging to make it appear like you are getting the same amount of product or even more when that isn’t the case. Revlon is pulling this trick with it’s lipgloss. Revlon decided to bulk up packaging for Superlustrous glosses but you are actually getting less product.  The new version only has .13 ounces, while the old version had .20 ounces. Guess what? Priced the same.

Jif peanut butter just reduced their 18oz jar by 11% no notice, nothing. They are counting on you being distracted or just dumb. This plan is working wonderfully so far and it is spreading like wildfire.

If that isn’t enough  Angel Soft was bragging on it’s packaging it contains “70% more.” Then the next packaging design dropped the 70% claim and added a more subtle change from 400sq ft to 354sq ft  while keeping the price the same.

Is it a problem? Here are some more products  that have been downsizing on the downlow. Oreos, Dawn soap, Dial soap, Bounty, Pampers, Gillette Fusion, Hefty, Kleenex *

I’m not sure how we stop it but if you contact the companies who are trying to quietly pick our pockets some will send you coupons as a sort of “we’re sorry”. It will also let them know we are paying attention and don’t like being taken advantage of.

Here are links to a couple companies to file a complaint about this downsizing trend.

Kleenex

Kraft/Nabisco

 

 

*source http://incredibleshrinkinggroceries.com/

Other links-

Consumerist

Consumerworld

Porn be gone!

pornfree

Baptist preacher Jay Dennis of the First Baptist Church at the Mall in Lakeland, Florida wants to stop porn. It’s worse than crack cocaine he says. He says it’s been called the new bubonic plague. Maybe a little dramatic considering without treatment, the bubonic plague kills about two thirds of infected humans within 4 days. In the 14th century it killed an estimated 25 million people, or 30–60% of the European population. We would be in serious trouble if jay was right about the plague thing.

I went and checked out The First Baptist Church at the Mall  and it is legit. Jay Dennis even mentions atheists in one of his posts “I am Intolerant of the ACLU and Atheist Groups who tout First Amendment Rights yet attempt to shut down any praying in government or education, want to remove Christmas from our vocabulary in the public sector, and won’t rest until they remove every cross from any public place”  ( I contacted him about this already)

Jay is currently taking on porn. He claims it is the #1 issue effecting men in the Christian church. He says 80% of men in the church are struggling with porn on some level. To battle this evil which must involve Satan somehow. Jay has started Join 1 Million Men.

Join 1 Million Men is “a daily process of surrendering to the holy spirit” and some other stuff and biblical truth. Jay doesn’t care if you have to “destroy your personal computer” you need to get porn out of your life because it causes men to become useless masturbating bums who don’t go to work and need to touch their penis just like a crack head needs a rock.

Jay is asking men to take the pledge to remove porn from their lives from now until they go to heaven. I guess if you go to hell you are out of luck but if you go to heaven that’s the end of the pledge and you’ll be watching the archangel banging the hell (so to speak) out of some naughty nurses before you know it!

According to the anti-porn crusader the chances your son has seen some porn is nearly 100%.  Satan uses porn as a tool ( get it?) to do evil stuff to your children and distract them from the usual stuff 10 year old boys do, like masturbation. Hey that doesn’t make any…..whatever.    The catch is you have to be a boy 10 years old or over to join in the pledge so all you 6-9 years old boys get your porn in while you can cause before you know it you will be limited to watching naked characters on the cartoon network. At least until you get to heaven, then it’s “Debbie Does The Last Supper” every Friday night for eternity.

I checked out “the wall” where men can sign and pledge to remove all the porn from their lives. So far a little over 500 men have made the pledge to smash their computers if needed to keep from watching porn. I guess that’s a lot. It’s more than I expected to see.

0e1142739_one-million-men-porn-free-logo

Think of how happy this guy would be watching porn. Maybe there is a problem

While there is a certain percentage of the population that claim to have an addiction to porn so serious that it negatively effects their lives I don’t understand the need to remove it totally from everyone’s life. There are 10x as many people who watch porn and have no problem.

I  started thinking – Jay seems to be in denial of is a lot of women watch porn too. What about them? Jay also doesn’t consider the number of couples who may have saved their marriage by making porn part of their sexual routine. He is out to remove it altogether. Well my questions were soon answered. There is a wall for women too. The wall for women is not to pledge that they wont look at porn it is a pledge to help stop men from watching porn. Maybe he figures if the men get rid of it the women will have to obey. There is one tiny problem. Only 168 women have committed to stopping the men from looking at porn vs 500+ men who said they would remove it from their lives. I see a possible conflict arising from this whole thing.

Another  thing Jay never mentions is those damn Mormons. Those perverts watch more online porn than any other state in the USA according to the last poll I saw on the subject. Does he have plans to deal with them in the future?

I’ll give jay credit, he does seem to be taking a hardline on this, he isn’t gonna go soft on porn. Even if he has to bang on and look behind every green door in his city, he will be grabbing people’s knockers and having a three-way with couples across his town to spread his news. He will go down every alley, even if he makes himself look like a boob in the process. Jay knows in the end he can hold his head erect and know that when it came to porn he rubbed it out as hard and fast as he could.

He even has a booklet called “The Hardcore Battle Plan” that comes in one version for men and one for women.

Here is Jay’s video promoting his Join 1 Million Men crusade.

Introduction from New Hope Publishers on Vimeo.

 

I’d also like to offer my help to Jay Dennis by offering to take any porn his followers want to get rid of and making sure they never see it again. Who says I never rise to the occasion?

Small Battle Won

 

dungeonclosed

Closed- No apologies will be issued

   While talking with Ally Fogg from FTB this past week I brought up the dungeon. The dungeon was a page where PZ Myers would list the people he had banned from his blog in a strange childlike manner. It was like   looking at the notches on a belt. For every character assassination there was a name and the manner in which their character has been killed with libel by PZ.  Ally claimed no knowledge of it and after the conversation I wondered what the dungeon looked like since PZ was banning anyone who was associated with the slymepit and he claimed I had created more than 30 fake accounts then there should be quite a list. At least 30 names supposedly on account of me alone.

When I went to look….the dungeon was gone. How could this be? I wondered how, what , why? Could it be that PZ had finally seen the light and recognized his behavior was juvenile and unfair? Could we count on PZ to focus on real issues instead of the regular trashing of someone based on some paranoid delusion in PZ’s head?  Then I found this. It’s a post from June 10th 2013 called No More Mr. Nice Guy. (allow me to suggest PZ get someone to write his titles for him cause they usually make no sense)

After reading the post I was a little let-down. PZ never mentions how his dungeon may have been unfair  or a bad idea.

He says

So yes, I’m fed up and I’ll be taking stronger action against these trolls and other assholes. But that does not in any way imply that I’m silencing disagreement…but that’s the message the trolls and assholes want to send out, to foment more harassment.I don’t ban that many people, and those that I do kick out, I try to be open about it, listing their names on the Dungeon page. Which leads to the other lie: that I’m unusually censorious. It turns out that being transparent about necessary banning actions, while just about every other goddamn blog out there just invisibly disappears objectionable junk, leads these phonies to make up more lies about policies here.

So I’m also changing something else. The Dungeon is gone. From now on, if you’re a jerk, you just get zapped and disappear forever, with no documentation, just like it’s done on the blogs of the assholes who accuse me of banning people for disagreeing with me.
It’ll save me a little work, too.

It’s kinda strange cause the people PZ disagrees with are often referred to as “assholes”, “jerks” or “slymers” which are all also the same terms he uses when talking about the people he has banned. I wonder, could this be the cause of some of the confusion PZ claims there is among critics of his policies?  I think so. PZ needs to be more clear or admit that as soon as someone doesn’t choose to see things his way in what he considers a proper amount of time they are told to shut up. If that instruction is not followed then they are banned. PZ doesn’t ban you for disagreeing, he bans you for not shutting up about your disagreement and for not changing your mind to agree with him. (note: you can also be banned for saying uncomplimentary things about his “horde”)

PZ also says he will be taking “stronger action” against the trolls and assholes. I don’t know what action he is planning on taking since there really is very little he can do about people who are posting comments unless he starts to approve comments.

Now if we could get PZ Myers on board the “No personal attacks” train then we will be on our way to a more peaceful interaction between not just skeptics and atheists but with believers too. I think a good way to ease into that would be for PZ to start better controlling his comment section. In the past he has bragged about how tough his horde is when in actuality they are just mean and intent on hurting people.Very little of their content is valid counter arguments, it is mostly personal insults, playground caliber name calling and threats. The number of people who seem to use PZ’s comment section as a way to vent frustrations is disturbing.

After all is said and done even with PZ making a clear attempt pretend this is all just because he choose to do it and the motivation was all the lies being told about him…it is a win.

PZ did something right by taking the dungeon page down and I will give him credit for that. It’s still too bad it wasn’t done because PZ recognized it was unfair and wrong but at least he has been stopped from continuously misrepresenting people. Pressure from others was also a factor so there is hope.

Not only that but it saves me a little work too.

Side-note: People can quit assuming I am somehow ‘obsessed’ with PZ too since it took a month for me to notice he posted about the removal I obviously don’t pay nearly the attention he claims I do. Sorry PZ, wrong about me again buddy, keep trying.

 

 

Oh-boycott

sadrebeccaIn case you haven’t heard enough of Rebecca Watson telling you what to do she is at it again here. She is pissed that a white male is allowed to have a voice. Even though he spoke about a legitimate issue involving feminism. It wasn’t what she wanted to talk about and most importantly  it wasn’t said by the gender she wanted to see/hear talking about it. How can anyone call themselves a skeptic and be so obviously biased? Follow that with the fact she is so ignorant of her own bias she parades it around screaming and pointing at it without even realizing it.

The Center For Inquiry issued a statement that supported Ron Lindsay and it is straight to the point. Rebecca can’t understand how it is possible to make a point by being clear and leaving out any rhetoric. She thinks that you need to draw things out , you need to insult people, build some resentment. Rebecca prefers to be vague so people might take your point the wrong way and then you can slam them and tell them how stupid they are. She likes to make it sound like people who disagree with her believe in the exact opposite. Kinda like the way religious people will reply to someone who says they don’t believe in god. “Oh your one of them satanists then huh?”  because simple people need to think in simple terms. If you don’t like steak you are a vegetarian. You don’t drink? You are a recovering alcoholic. You aren’t a feminist? You hate women. See? Simple. To consider there are many different perspectives or maybe there is more than one way to solve a problem is too much trouble. You can’t judge people if you are trying to understand where they are coming from. Besides, where is the drama in that ? I imagine Rebecca would have liked to see CFI  reply with a statement that looked more like this-

Rebecca Watson’s Center for Inquiry Board of Directors Statement on the CEO and the Rebecca Watson Women in Secularism 2 Conference

The mission of the Rebecca Watson Center for Inquiry is to foster a secular feminist society based on Rebecca Watson, science, freedom of inquisition , Rebecca Watson, and feminist values.

The Rebecca Watson Center for Inquiry, unincluding its CEO whether he likes it or not, is dedicated to advancing the status of Rebecca Watson, women and promoting Rebecca Watson’s issues, and this was the motivation for Rebecca Watson’s sponsorship of the two Rebecca Watson Women in Secularism conferences. The CFI Board & Rebecca Watson wishes to express its unhappiness with all men especially white men except PZ MYERS (cause he is the one man who ‘gets us’ ) at the recent Women in Secularism Conference 2.

Rebecca Watson & CFI believes in respectful debate and dialogue in other places maybe but not here. We appreciate worship Rebecca Watson and the many insights and varied opinions communicated to us by her. Going forward, Rebecca Watson will endeavor to work with all elements of the secular movement to force our her values on them and strengthen our solidarity as we struggle together for full equality and then some for only women around the world.

But…that didn’t happen. So now she is calling for a boycott of CFI. She is not going to do anymore to support them especially because they haven’t invited her to. Rebecca here is a little something you should know. You can’t quit a job after you get fired. Maybe keep that in mind if you ever get a job. Unless you have one now , I’m not sure cause you never seem to talk much about any actual work you’ve done.

Maybe you could get a job looking after  PZ’s  ‘horde’. you know cleaning out the cages and putting the hose on ’em every so often. Patting them on the head whenever some son of a bitch doesn’t give them a trigger warning and they melt down. ….just a thought.

Rebecca goes on to cry about the harassment she keeps getting and finally we see an example of the extreme hatred

How could anyone dare suggest Rebecca lives in another universe? Is there no end to the vile behavior Rebecca must endure?!  If this is the current level of ‘hate’ she is getting and it still is too much I hope she stays away from playgrounds and catholic schools cause the shit that goes on in those places is off the hook!

I’d like to hear, just once,  Rebecca make a plea to people asking for them to try and find common ground or to be less confrontational. What would have happened if Rebecca would have released her own statement a while back. Maybe something like this –

“Look, I can see there is a huge problem that seems to be doing harm to atheists and skeptics. I’m outspoken and I can see how I could have maybe just a little contributed to this problem. I’d like to help fix it by making some things clear- I’d like to tell all the people who are making actual threats towards me- I’m calling the cops. Those of you who are all talk – STFU cause I don’t give a shit. Every single shit message you send gets deleted, your time wasted. Thanks for spending some of your limited time on earth  thinking of me, I’m flattered. To all the reasonable people including the ones who disagree- Let’s focus on the things we agree on and by working together maybe we will come to understand where each of us is coming from. We are going to have arguments and fights but let’s realize when we have taken it to the point where no one benefits  except the people we both disagree with and that means we all lose.

Or we can just build a list of people/groups who don’t do what we want and withdraw support until we are only supporting skepticism by donating time to…well there isn’t anyone who does things exactly like we would do them ourselves so where does that leave us?

Rebecca, thanks for all your work to help make the world a place where skeptics don’t tolerate opposing opinions and no one supports rational thought and drama is favored over rational debate. Your contribution is noted.