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My proudly violent country.
JohnH
I am a football fan specifically of the 49ers. So today I went to the bar to watch them play the Seahawks. I decided when the game was over to stick around and watch the Sunday night game. I could not last through. Someone asked the bar maid to turn on some stupid show trying to memorialize the events of 10 years ago. I could not stomach it because of the ugliness my own country caused because of those events.

Oddly I was hiking the John Muir trail 10 years ago with my two sons. We had come out to camp near a small resort at lake Thomas Edison so that my wife could resupply us. Very odd events to be confronted with after three weeks of mostly enjoyable times in the woods and mountains.

The next day while my children and I smoked a joint before starting to hike (yes they were/are adults) I said two things to them about the events of the day before. I said I was afraid our government would use those events as an excuse to do some evil things, that turned out to be an accurate prediction. I also said that we should not talk about it with anyone unless they brought it up, no one did.

Please understand some things. I love my country's people, I have lived almost my entire life within about 30 miles of where I was born. I have great sympathy for the people who died 10 years ago and their loved ones.

But, my government used the events of 10 years ago as justification for vile acts. I have a problem with that fact and memorializing the events and the deaths without paying attention to how we have behaved since is something I cannot accept.

I was so angry I audibly said "turn that shit off". A man, I do not know, near the door to the bar heard that and looked at me. On the way out I said to him "It is difficult being a citizen of a country that revels in violence and memorializes in such odd ways".
 
Theory_Execution
There was a headline on a free paper I get today "Country remembers its victims and heros", to my mind that said the hundreds of thousands of innocents dragged into pointless wars who lost their lives... in reality that meant the initial victims of an atrocious act and the home nation soldiers that died in the wars that followed.

I agree JohnH, it's fucking disgusting.
 
seeker
The sad thing is that everyone dwells on the crime committed by Islamic Terrorists that day and ignores the far greater crime committed by the Bush Administration.

Hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqis, tens of thousands of dead Afghanis, thousands of dead coalition forces.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
 
JohnH
No Seeker the far greater crime was not committed by Bush. It was committed by the american people. As much as I love my country my fellow citizens can behave foolishly and badly.
 
seeker
Hmmm, chicken or egg.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
 
catman
I'd say Bush's actions reflected that portion of the American people who voted for and supported him. That does not include me. My thoughts were 'Afghanistan, maybe. Iraq, NO'.
 
JohnH
I was reminded today of an other important 9-11, in 1973. The day that the military of Chile, led by that noted democrat, Augusto Pinochet attacked the presidential palace causing the death of Salvador Allende and the death of democracy in that country. That event led to almost 20 years of horror for the people of Chile.

Events if not directly sponsored by the US certainly condoned and supported. America has far to much blood on its hands.
 
seeker
Definitely sponsored by the US. Allende was a Marxist and, even though he was democratically elected, the US had a policy of preventing leftist governments in Latin America.

As you said, Pinochet was a disaster.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
 
catman
Agreed. I've been pissed off about the Allende assassination since it happened.
 
Theory_Execution
You want to talk about modern day terrorism, look at the war on drugs.
 
seeker
Look at the fake 'debt crisis' and the even more fake debt ceiling nonsense.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
 
catman
When the national debt tripled under Reagan, none of the Republicans seemed to care. Reagan is almost a demigod to them, with many of today's Republican candidates paying endless homage to his genius.
"If I owned both Hell and Texas, I'd live in Hell and rent out Texas." - General Sheridan
 
JohnH
Catman, I am afraid it does kind of work both ways. When the Warren Court was essentially making law in a lot of its decisions liberals did not particularly care. The current conservative court essentially makes law and liberals are very troubled.

I agree that the concern over the debt is duplicitous but in general all of politics is.
 
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