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Because we are animals
JohnH
While reading a post here that fell into a somewhat esoteric philosophical argument I remembered the real tipping point in my rejection of religion.

We are animals. We have a life span, we eat, we sleep, we shit and piss. Religion tries to make us something greater then that, in doing so it removes us from the most fundamental fact of our existence.

Why might a discussion of philosophy remind me of that. Actually for the very same reason. Any philosophy that goes beyond a discussion of should we be a herd, a pack, or a hive misses that essential point. I personally vote for the hive (with the possible exception of the mormon concept of it).

In the interest of full disclosure the only philosopher I tried to read with any care was Marx. I found my head splitting, not sure if it was the fact of translation from the german or my lack of ability. About the only philosophical books I have had any luck with are things like Bertrand Russell's "Why I am not a Christian.

With the above admission I will stand by my basic point. The attempt to elevate humans to better then the other animals because we can think is wrong. Yes it means our actions can have forethought and be less driven by instinct. That does not elevate us to some superior position. It in general only makes our failings more grave.

No I do not take these thoughts so far that I do not use animal products. I will also point out to vegans that they still kill the thing that they eat, even if it has gone to seed that seed has the possibility of reproduction.
 
General-Pryce
I point out at every opportunity that we are animals, and I'm quite proud of that. With religion, we just appeared because God decided he was bored. With evolution and us being animals, we fought against adversity and overcame problems we faced. Fundies criticise and ridicule, pointing out that we can think we are apes if we want but they are divine. I see being an ape an achievement, against all odds.

 
cheshiredragon
I agree GP. I think that it is great that we evolved. Not a huge fan of chimps but, that what makes us better is that we evolved from that state. I have had the pleasure once before of being able to interact with a 300LB female Gorilla that knew sign language. Extremely intelligent but, you can still tell where the evolution line is drawn. This does make me proud to be at the top of the evolution chain, even if most of the human species is not.
That's right, I said it...
 
derF
Being at the top of the food chain may be advantageous but it certainly is not divine. There are many people (and perhaps a few other life forms) who think the world would be a lot better off without our thoughtless greedy selves mucking up the planet.
I'll drink to that. Or anything else for that matter.
 
cheshiredragon
derF wrote:
There are many people (and perhaps a few other life forms) who think the world would be a lot better off without our thoughtless greedy selves mucking up the planet.

Well said. Bill Hicks said it best when he said:
"We are a virus with shoes."
That's right, I said it...
 
neilmarr
Not only are we apes, but we are African apes. I reckon that fact alone must get up some Deep South noses. Neil
 
derF
neilmarr wrote:
Not only are we apes, but we are African apes. I reckon that fact alone must get up some Deep South noses. Neil


Yes, we haven't progressed far, I'm afraid.
I'll drink to that. Or anything else for that matter.
 
catman
Apes with nuclear weapons and religion. That doesn't sound good.
"If I owned both Hell and Texas, I'd live in Hell and rent out Texas." - General Sheridan
 
derF
All hail Catman! The mythical being. What sort of mythical powers does that title bestow on you?
Edited by derF on 11/03/2008 00:26
I'll drink to that. Or anything else for that matter.
 
General-Pryce
I'm waiting to see what happens when he hits 1000
 
catman
No one believes in me any more. [sniff]
"If I owned both Hell and Texas, I'd live in Hell and rent out Texas." - General Sheridan
 
derF
catman wrote:
No one believes in me any more. [sniff]



True. But we don't believe in you any less either. (Hee, hee, hee) Grin
I'll drink to that. Or anything else for that matter.
 
catman
I don't even believe in myself. That's the real problem!Wink
"If I owned both Hell and Texas, I'd live in Hell and rent out Texas." - General Sheridan
 
neilmarr
Can non-belief be a *real* problem? Neil
 
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